Payment Method

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Radiacity
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Payment Method

Post by Radiacity » September 25th, 2014, 1:05 pm

I think the big topic that's probably going to be brought up sooner or later is the payment method for this game. Simply put, how will they decide to profit out of this game. The main payment methods are Free to Play (In-game shop), Pay to Play (Subscription), and Buy to play (One time fee). Although there are also sub-categories within the 3, what would you like as the payment model for this game?
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Vrenna » September 25th, 2014, 2:47 pm

If the game is good enough I wont even mind a subscription method.

B2P:
Up till now the best I found was GW2's one. You buy the game, and the game is yours.
All the updates, the future of that game, everything is yours. They get decent return from the very start, and they do a reasonable ammount of updates and changes all the time. You're constantly rewarded for "supporting" that game. Plus, there is the shop that gives you things that don't unbalance the game, so it's fine. The only problem I found with the game was that... there's no demo version, that's needed honestly.

F2P:
The worst method I found, which is the one I use more, is the free to play.
Free to play games tend to be crap with time. You're mostly forced to be rich to have access to all the content in the game, otherwise you're limited in something. People tend to say to valorize the ones who spend money, because they support the game and let you play for free, but I look it another way: It's thanks to people that don't valorize their money and are scammed with a smile in their faces, that I'm forced to have my game content limited. I can't support a game since the only choices are unreasonable prices for things that don't have the value they ask for (20$ for a piece of digital cloth? You kidding me?), because I'm not the wallet that they are aiming for, mine is a selective one. And since I've been always a player that likes looks over stats, the actual system of only charging for looks (and with insane prices) got me really bad. The good thing about F2P games is that you have the perfect demo: If the game is bad, you just lost time.

P2P:
And subscription is uh... for good games only. No reason to keep paying something that isn't worth your dedication. My main issue with subscription is that you pay for a time you wont spend. You get a month, but 1/3 of it you sleep, 1/3 you study/work, and part of the rest of the time is spent with other things. You didn't got a moth worth of playtime, you got the right to play the game for the next month, it's different.
I wish they actually sold solid "Time" instead of that loan system.

For a game like Tree of Savior... I think any will do. Because if a game is good, anything will do.
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Updater3000 » September 25th, 2014, 3:05 pm

There is TERA who is actually the only decent F2P game I know (because I am still playing it), you get all the content for free + they give you rewards like costumes, and it's the only game that warn you for playing 2h non-stop (lol they think about your health care XD).

For ToS an F2P or a P2P is the most likely to fit to the game, I saw many mmo sites that say the game will be an F2P (I don't know if it is true or just a cunning to get more views on the videos.
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Zoran » September 25th, 2014, 6:14 pm

F2P without a P2W cash shop would be ideal, B2P could work well too if done correctly & priced fairly.. I highly doubt they'd go for a sub route with this particular title, the expectations that would come from needing top notch balance, smooth gameplay, and good customer service would be high and would backfire badly if they fail to meet them
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Icystare » September 25th, 2014, 7:42 pm

If their previous title were to give an indication of the payment model they will decide to use, it'll end up as a F2P with cash shop. At first they went with a P2P model with Granada Espada but that quickly changed when they didn't get the numbers they desired.
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Radiacity » September 25th, 2014, 10:23 pm

I have a feeling this game is probably going to be Free to Play. Since this game is marketed to people 13-17, a pay to play game would probably drive away a part of the playerbase despite how many people want that. That and the fact that they really need to up the game quality if they want to keep it like that. There have been people that want a time based subscription. but honestly, I don't want to be obligated that I have to make every minute count in the game.

A buy to play game is good but it is risky if the game is not growing and gaining constant people to play unless an in-game shop is implemented with that. Although I would be down for this idea depending on the available payment methods.

The optimal choice is probably free to play with cosmetics, donations, and some "efficiency" boosts such as exp and drop rate increases, instant teleports and faster hp, mp, and stamina regen. Nothing that will directly boosts stats and won't cause a major change in the gameplay between a paying and non-paying user.

We'll probably get an update on the payment method once the game gets closer to release.
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Updater3000 » September 25th, 2014, 10:50 pm

I fear the cash shop items like "Enchantment protections/Safety Upgrade Scroll", if those items appears in the cash shop then expect that the enchantment/Upgrade success rate will be very low.
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Radiacity » September 26th, 2014, 12:44 am

Updater3000 wrote:I fear the cash shop items like "Enchantment protections/Safety Upgrade Scroll", if those items appears in the cash shop then expect that the enchantment/Upgrade success rate will be very low.
I really hope this game won't be pay to win. I still have chills over Maplestory.

I feel this video gives a true and honest opinion about the publishers mindset when making a pay to win game. And what actually happens to those games in the long run.
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Phonetics » September 26th, 2014, 10:03 pm

I would still prefer pay to play even though it may be unlikely. It decreases alot of bots and it gives a better community since people won't be toxic or they'll risk losing their money they spent. I don't know about buy to play though, the main games I've seen have it is Minecraft, GW2, and console games.
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Re: Payment Method

Post by andysunstory » September 27th, 2014, 2:18 am

The ideal situation (for me anyway) would be F2P except with a highly buffed out Cash Shop filled with cosmetics with no stat boosts whatsoever. This would also work for 'Buy Once, play forever' as well.

I know many people would have no problems paying couple dollars here and there to pimp their character to reflect themselves more or even the current season (for eg. Christmas time might have Santa Hats and Candy Canes cosmetics on sale etc). But ultimately, to achieve strong gear, you still need to play, raid, pvp and all that good stuff.

Subscription model would just decrease the playerbase by that much - since players will be pressured to play their money's worth rather than play for fun.
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Mr.Nova » September 27th, 2014, 2:56 am

andysunstory wrote:The ideal situation (for me anyway) would be F2P except with a highly buffed out Cash Shop filled with cosmetics with no stat boosts whatsoever. This would also work for 'Buy Once, play forever' as well.

I know many people would have no problems paying couple dollars here and there to pimp their character to reflect themselves more or even the current season (for eg. Christmas time might have Santa Hats and Candy Canes cosmetics on sale etc). But ultimately, to achieve strong gear, you still need to play, raid, pvp and all that good stuff.

Subscription model would just decrease the playerbase by that much - since players will be pressured to play their money's worth rather than play for fun.
I hope though, for the sake of the game it doesn't go hugely unbalanced with cash shop cosmetics.

I hate games that let you play for free, but in order to buy anything remotely fashionable or aesthetically pleasing, you have to shell out 10-20 bucks.
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Rosenakahara » September 27th, 2014, 12:36 pm

B2p or P2P please, i really dont want to have to deal with all the p2w bs of f2p
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Vrenna » September 27th, 2014, 12:52 pm

I think they should try B2P.

Considering the hype and the aparent quality of the game they will get enough buyers no doubt. I don't think anyone here wouldn't get the game for 30-40$ to be able to play it forever after, we just want the thing really hard, and we feel in the core of our souls that this game will be an addiction for the next few years.

I got GW2 for 60$ and even though I've stopped playing already, I don't regret buying it at all, cause the game had quality and is ever changing/improving, thanks to that system I kind of made an investment, since I can get in new content anytime I want now.

From what I see of ToS now, the situation is ideal for a B2P system: They have buyers, like crazy.
They also seem to enjoy developing the game, and have future plans for it, so the game can continue developing. Of course B2P can have a cash shop, but since they already have an initial income, they can make something that doesn't aim whales (the rich people), and so the game can be more enjoyable.
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Rosenakahara » September 27th, 2014, 1:32 pm

Vrenna wrote:I think they should try B2P.

Considering the hype and the aparent quality of the game they will get enough buyers no doubt. I don't think anyone here wouldn't get the game for 30-40$ to be able to play it forever after, we just want the thing really hard, and we feel in the core of our souls that this game will be an addiction for the next few years.

I got GW2 for 60$ and even though I've stopped playing already, I don't regret buying it at all, cause the game had quality and is ever changing/improving, thanks to that system I kind of made an investment, since I can get in new content anytime I want now.

From what I see of ToS now, the situation is ideal for a B2P system: They have buyers, like crazy.
They also seem to enjoy developing the game, and have future plans for it, so the game can continue developing. Of course B2P can have a cash shop, but since they already have an initial income, they can make something that doesn't aim whales (the rich people), and so the game can be more enjoyable.
This, as much as i like p2p few games these days actually have content worth paying the sub, with B2P games they can have a cash shop but not have it impact the quality of the game or make you pay to win
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Moki » September 27th, 2014, 6:16 pm

I think I might have found a hint to the payment method in the Q&A section.

"Q: Is server wide chatting available? We received a request from a fan that this feature should be in the game.
A: Yes. There is server wide chatting available in the game and you can do it using a mic."

It goes on to talk about it being similar to Granado Espada. Now usually the use of a "mic" item is seen in F2P games. If the game was P2P or even B2P they could have simply added a "/world chat" option to the chat menu, instead of making it an item you must acquire. The mic could be a one time item that you keep at lvl 30, but I'm not sure if they want to handle it that way.
So guys, tell me what you think? Is there NEI in this Q&A or do I got something here. :pif:
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Radiacity » September 27th, 2014, 7:03 pm

Moki wrote:I think I might have found a hint to the payment method in the Q&A section.

"Q: Is server wide chatting available? We received a request from a fan that this feature should be in the game.
A: Yes. There is server wide chatting available in the game and you can do it using a mic."

It goes on to talk about it being similar to Granado Espada. Now usually the use of a "mic" item is seen in F2P games. If the game was P2P or even B2P they could have simply added a "/world chat" option to the chat menu, instead of making it an item you must acquire. The mic could be a one time item that you keep at lvl 30, but I'm not sure if they want to handle it that way.
So guys, tell me what you think? Is there NEI in this Q&A or do I got something here. :pif:
It could also be buy to play at the same time because most buy to play mmos also have a cash shop with cosmetics since you won't make that much from only a purchase fee. (Especially smaller companies).
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Mr.Nova » September 27th, 2014, 7:42 pm

I hate games that force you to pay for global chat.

It's a stupid restriction.

In my opinion the only legitimate restriction for global would be a level restriction to avoid bot spammers.

Otherwise screw that and just join a guild.

Paying for global chat is just another way to milk money out of people who would be willing to pay for actual content.
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Rosenakahara » September 27th, 2014, 9:02 pm

Mr.Nova wrote:I hate games that force you to pay for global chat.

It's a stupid restriction.

In my opinion the only legitimate restriction for global would be a level restriction to avoid bot spammers.

Otherwise screw that and just join a guild.

Paying for global chat is just another way to milk money out of people who would be willing to pay for actual content.
I really hope they just meant you get a mic item after a certain level that stays with you because i haaaaate paying for global chat
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Re: Payment Method

Post by chenner » October 29th, 2014, 3:07 am

I personally prefer p2p, but this is speaking from the perspective of a full time worker

I support f2p with a cosmetic/boost/teleport cash shop but not a pay to win model

b2p is fine with me too
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Re: Payment Method

Post by Iden » October 29th, 2014, 5:19 pm

Updater3000 wrote:There is TERA who is actually the only decent F2P game I know (because I am still playing it), you get all the content for free + they give you rewards like costumes, and it's the only game that warn you for playing 2h non-stop (lol they think about your health care XD).

For ToS an F2P or a P2P is the most likely to fit to the game, I saw many mmo sites that say the game will be an F2P (I don't know if it is true or just a cunning to get more views on the videos.
TERA's cash shop is complete shit though. Letting you buy non-account bound stuff breaks the economy and gives an unfair advantage. People with enough dough can go full masterwork alche without running any dungeons. Also at least Gameforge has a lot of RNG boxes, which are a really shady business imo. Of course it's not stupid who asks but who pays.
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As I've previously stated somewhere, GGG's the only company that handles f2p-model well. Valve is so-so, hats don't affect gameplay but they sure do lure certain kind of playerbase.
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