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Swordy Builds

Posted: April 24th, 2015, 8:29 am
by Delisle
I was feeling that the weapon restriction was forcing you to make specific choice, so I start to check some build for different weapon and the system seems better that I thought, there is no thousand of build that look efficient, but 8 build that I found that look good. I don't believe in weapon switching, so they are all single type of weapon.

One Handed Spear
Shield Path: Swordy 1 - Peltasta 2 - Rodelero 3
To be honest, this one is straight forward. Peltasta got Swash Buckling, Guardian and High Guard, the ideal Tank skills. Third Circle is a attack skill and it's not worth missing Rodelero. Shield Charge, Targe Smash and Shield Push are good, I don't know the weapon requirements for Slithering, but it could be interesting.

Hoplite Path: Swordy 2 - Hoplite 3 - Centurion / Doppelsoldner 1
At first, I thought about squeezing Peltasta in rank 2, but the skill of the Peltasta are for tank. I would have to put skill points into Swash Buckling or Guardian and I don't think it would be meaningful. The 2nd Circle from the Swordy allows to raise your bash and thrust to 10 and they are the skill with the lowest cooldown, 6 seconds. If you compare the dsp of Peltasta 1 and Swordy 2, it's almost the same for skills only.
Peltasta 1: 83+(3*47)+(3*43)+88=441 or 21dps (115 SP)
Swordy 2: (3*77)+(3*73) = 450 or 21.4dps (102 SP)
But it doesn't factor the raise of damage from a higher Concentrate and the fact that during the animation of the skills from the Peltasta, regular melee attack can be made. I don't have data on those, so I can only assume.
So there is a advantage to raise the Swordy to the Second Circle.
We are making a Offensive One Handed Spear character, so it's going to be Hoplite for 3 circles.
The last class depend on you. Centurion for party player. Doppelsoldner have some buff that can be interesting.

Two Handed Spear
Bash & Thrust Path: Swordy 3 - Cataphract 3
This build is completely offensive. Because of the weapon requirements, most of the classes of Rank 2 and 3 cannot be used. Like we saw in the Hoplite Path, the Swordy have a good dps. Bash and Thrust are going to be useful to fill the long cooldown of the Cataphract. It's the only classes that use a 2 Handed Spear, so we rank it up to the 3rd Circle. Anyway, Rush is a must have.

Striking Path: Swordy 2 - Barbarian 1 - Cataphract 3
Almost the same that the previous build, but we swap the 3rd Circle of the Swordy for Barbarian. The goal is to get Savagery, because Dragging Death, Impaler and Thrust will get a bonus strike attack property. Aggressor make you always hit, Frenzy boosts your successive basic attacks and Warcry reduce the enemy armor.

One Handed Sword
Dual Wielding Path: Swordy 2 - Barbarian 2 - Corsair 2
There is a big assumption with this path. This build used a dagger as a sub weapon. You get the 2nd Circle of the Swordy, because you have no use for Highlander or Peltasta. Frenzy to increase your attack power and Savagery to add the strike bonus to your dagger. You get Corsair 2nd Circle for the Sub Weapon Cancel.
The big assumption is if you can stack Frenzy, Savagery and Sub Weapon Cancel, if it's the case, you're going to make crazy and fast damage.

Shield Path: Swordy 1 - Peltasta 2 - Rodelero 3
Same as the Shield Path from One Handed Spear but with a sword and the sword attack skill from Rodelero.

Two Handed Sword
Barbarian Path: Swordy 1 - Highlander 1 - Barbarian 3 - Doppelsoldner 1
This one is simple, we want the buff and badass skills from the Barbarian. We could have kept the Swordy for the second circle instead of Highlander, but Crown and Cross Guard can be good skills in certain contexts (Boss and Magic User).

Yoyo Path: Swordy 1 - Highlander 3 - Corsair 1 - Doppelsoldner 1
Highlander have attacks that throw enemy far away... So you get bring them back with the Corsair's Keelhauling. Combo: Iron Hook, Wagon Wheel and Keelhauling.

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 24th, 2015, 1:52 pm
by KingTam
This is actually quite a fantastic topic to start. I, myself am a Warrior player since I was young, and I have indeed looked through all of these builds. Normally, I would've went for your Dual-Wield build, before Corsair's skills showed up, except for the fact that they can dual-wield. I thought I could combo Barbarian's Frenzy with the Dual-Wield really well, but looking at Corsair, I don't really like the class' skills. Now I thought about going for the Two-Handed Sword build, where it goes swordsman, highlander, triple barb and dopplesoldner.

I think its quite an innovative topic. Maybe we should make one for each of the classes. That'd be really fun tbh.

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 24th, 2015, 2:47 pm
by Albe
I think your unbelief on weapon swap is wrong in the beginning, having much offensive skills to use one weapon, and some defensive on another... or having a melee weapon and a ranged weapon offers you more choices to adapt to the fight may it be pve or a future implementation of pvp
It's right to stitch on your profession specialization and take you role, but theres time when you just need to change strategy on the go unless you like to wipe often ;) .

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 24th, 2015, 7:47 pm
by Delisle
Albe, if you have a good build that use weapon switch and still have a good flow in battle, share it with us. That's kind of the goal of this post. A lot of people seems to go Cleric for melee character, so I was wondering if the simple approach to weapon could also be the cause.

My disbelief in weapon switch comes from recent experience in ESO. I did a Battle Mage, Sword+Shield / Destruction Staff. The ranged attacks of the staff weren't worth it compare to the amount of mistake that I did confusing the weapon state I was in. In a fast paced game, it is better to fix your key layout and use the more possible your muscle memory. If you got the same key bind to 2 different actions, you need to remember your current state before pressing a key, so you cannot be as fast.

My builds also doesn't have a lot of classes, 3 classes most of the time and almost all have a 3rd Circle. So I can keep the number of skill low. I'm planning to play with a controller, so I want max 12 skills and have 4 keys for items. This way, I know that when my fingers would have map a skill on the controller, I'll never have to think about my current weapon and have a good reaction speed. I think that fast reaction time is a better way to adapt to a situation that a versatile build.

Anyway, share with us your builds, I'm interested in your take on the subject.

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 24th, 2015, 8:16 pm
by Sentper
I am also fairly skeptical of how reliable weapon swapping will be, considering how so many skills are locked to one weapon. Swordsmen are not made for ranged attacks in general (hell, even Peltasta's shield throw leaves you with the risk of losing the shield if you don't pick it back up), so I really feel as though trying to focus your build on one weapon is essential.

I've come up with two incomplete spear builds, though. One for Cataphract, one for Hoplite, the latter being slightly more oriented towards defense.

The Cataphract one goes Swordsman2 > Hoplite 1 > Cataphract 3, making as much out of the Hoplite skills that can be used with a two-handed spear, and focusing on high damage output.

The Hoplite one, on the other hand, goes Swordsman 1 > Peltasta 1 > Hoplite 3, founding itself on Peltasta's Guardian skill and Hoplite's Synchro Thrusting skill to make the most out of the spear + shield combo.

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 24th, 2015, 9:41 pm
by Phelsetti
If they allow weapon swap system available, might as well utilize it! Only thing that might be an issue would be animations. Otherwise it's not so bad overall.

Here's a build I thought of that manages both of it with combo possibilities too.

Swords 1 - Highlander 2 - Rodelero 3

This is pretty standard and they both offer some defense.
One basic combo could be Wagon Wheel > Switch Shield Charge > Shooting Star > Switch Moulinet or any other offensive skills.

Wagon Wheel has a short and sweet animation that stop while enemies are knocked up. This offers you the time to switch to a gap closer like Shield Charge, once you're in you can strike them with a Shooting Star and then switch to a Moulinet to do some really heavy damage. Could be flexible for more things too.

Of course there is a cost for flexibility like management. Will you have enough SP to pull all of this? Will cool downs hinder some combos? Will they still live after this? Will a controller be able to implement all of this? There's a lot factors to consider. If they offer it might as well try it ya know? ;p

Edit: A lot of typos, was doing this on phone. :heh:

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 24th, 2015, 10:49 pm
by Swamp
This is my build:
Swordman - Peltasta - Hoplite - Cataphract - ? - ?

Swordman, because its a start, haha
Peltasta because i get Swash Buckling (Umbo Blow is also nice) and maybe even Guardian, which i didnt use during my last hours playing though.
Hoplite obviously for the DPS skills and the Crit Buff.
Cataphract for more AoE, but this might be changed to rodelero - i am not 100% sure yet.
? undecided
? undecided

It's pretty solid so far.

more videos will be uploaded to my youtube soon.


so, the perfect combo i would use right now is GungHo, Finestra, Swash Bockling, Concentrate, Stabbing, QQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQQ-> Dead.
If the target isnt dead, there are plenty of more skills to use like pierce and synchro Thrusting and Umbo Blow which is another good AoE skill.

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 24th, 2015, 11:33 pm
by Star.E.Knight
Albe wrote:I think your unbelief on weapon swap is wrong in the beginning, having much offensive skills to use one weapon, and some defensive on another... or having a melee weapon and a ranged weapon offers you more choices to adapt to the fight may it be pve or a future implementation of pvp
It's right to stitch on your profession specialization and take you role, but theres time when you just need to change strategy on the go unless you like to wipe often ;) .
Not really, I am one that doesn't like to swap weapons and I don't die very often in games that I play. Tera doesn't count... I wanted the Angel of Death title T_T you have to die 50 times for that... but anyway, it has to do with your play style, and you learn to adjust yourself so you don't die :) I also like the challenge cuz games don't seem as hard as they were when it was the age of SNES and Sega.



ANYWAY, on to the topic at hand, I'm not much of a swordy type person, I do really like the idea of the Yoyo build you have there. That build may have just changed my mind about making a swordy.

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 25th, 2015, 12:28 am
by Phelsetti
Ah forgot also with weapon swap, it doesn't even have to be different weapon types too! You can always have the same weapon type but with differing effects via gems and magic amulets. "Maybe this sword would be better against these mobs, while this sword would be better on those!" etc. etc.

The system has so much ways to use it other than merely skill access so don't shy out from using it, it's there for a reason. :heh:

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 27th, 2015, 1:20 am
by Wig
Hey guys. First post here. I've been creepin the forums for a few days. I have been messing with the skill calculator and had a question, hopefully this question hasn't been asked a million times. Are class attack abilities restricted to a certain weapon type. For example, I like the buffs and abilities that come with the hoplite class, but also some of the abilities that come from barb/highlander/doppel. Are the 2 hander class abilities restricted to 2 hander or can I use with a spear and shield?

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 27th, 2015, 1:50 am
by Delisle
Almost all attack skills are bound to a weapon type. So you need to swap weapon (imc added the mechanic in the cbt2), if you didn't have the right weapon. My builds doesn't use weapon swap, but it's a personal choice. This skill simulator and the associate skills pages on the website doesn't mention the restriction, but tosgame have them. We should add it on the wiki/site here too.

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 27th, 2015, 2:25 am
by Wig
Thank you for the quick reply. Weapon swapping has a time penalty of some sort?

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 27th, 2015, 5:36 am
by Delisle
Don't know.

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 27th, 2015, 1:11 pm
by lawnmower79
There's no point in this thread.

Currently the best build is one with barbarian in it, due to the skill Frenzy
Just watch this video of this barbarian taking down a boss after a few hits:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pA5H3b8MMVo

No other Swordsman class can offer anything near this kind of damage booster.
Sure, you can combine other classes with barbarian, but if everyone adds barbarian into their class change route and you don't, you're going to fall behind fast in terms of damage output as a Swordsman.

They better fix this skill, seriously...

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 28th, 2015, 2:14 am
by Delisle
What I see in this video is a level 121 fighting against a boss level 96. It's a closed beta, they are going to boost and nerf skills on feedback.

When you think that the only build worth being played is the OP build, you're simply going to end up whining when they nerf it.

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: April 28th, 2015, 12:36 pm
by lawnmower79
Delisle wrote:What I see in this video is a level 121 fighting against a boss level 96. It's a closed beta, they are going to boost and nerf skills on feedback.

When you think that the only build worth being played is the OP build, you're simply going to end up whining when they nerf it.
No, I fully support them nerfing this skill. This game's too good to be ruined by something like this.
The main selling point of this game is diversity and in order to achieve that they need balance. This skill currently does nothing to support that balance.

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: May 9th, 2015, 2:30 am
by gavino
I was thinking Sword->Sword->Hoplite->Hoplite->Corsair x3, etc...but only if that's possible. Has there been much discussion on the exclusivity of weapons for each class? Would be cool to pair up some spear skills with keelhauling. Also, is it possible to equip another weapon with a one handed spear? Doesn't seem like that's really possible, but if it is, the only Hoplite skill that requires a shield is finestra o_o

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: November 4th, 2015, 4:28 am
by warapong2531
Yoyo Path: Swordy 1 - Highlander 3 - Corsair 1 - Doppelsoldner 1

How to build skills for PVP

:lv: :lv:

Re: Swordy Builds

Posted: November 17th, 2015, 7:31 pm
by telocastelo
Delisle wrote:
Hoplite Path: Swordy 2 - Hoplite 3 - Centurion / Doppelsoldner 1
At first, I thought about squeezing Peltasta in rank 2, but the skill of the Peltasta are for tank. I would have to put skill points into Swash Buckling or Guardian and I don't think it would be meaningful. The 2nd Circle from the Swordy allows to raise your bash and thrust to 10 and they are the skill with the lowest cooldown, 6 seconds. If you compare the dsp of Peltasta 1 and Swordy 2, it's almost the same for skills only.
Peltasta 1: 83+(3*47)+(3*43)+88=441 or 21dps (115 SP)
Swordy 2: (3*77)+(3*73) = 450 or 21.4dps (102 SP)
But it doesn't factor the raise of damage from a higher Concentrate and the fact that during the animation of the skills from the Peltasta, regular melee attack can be made. I don't have data on those, so I can only assume.
So there is a advantage to raise the Swordy to the Second Circle.
We are making a Offensive One Handed Spear character, so it's going to be Hoplite for 3 circles.
The last class depend on you. Centurion for party player. Doppelsoldner have some buff that can be interesting.

Two Handed Spear
Bash & Thrust Path: Swordy 3 - Cataphract 3
This build is completely offensive. Because of the weapon requirements, most of the classes of Rank 2 and 3 cannot be used. Like we saw in the Hoplite Path, the Swordy have a good dps. Bash and Thrust are going to be useful to fill the long cooldown of the Cataphract. It's the only classes that use a 2 Handed Spear, so we rank it up to the 3rd Circle. Anyway, Rush is a must have.
About hoplite

If you plan pvp or party go to swordy 1 -> peltasta 1-> hoplite 3 -> doppel or cataph
Peltasta have awesome skill attributes, we cant look only the skills at all, wihtou pay attention to attributes.
Peltasta attributes include very good stun (25% umbo blow), knock down, HP increase (25% Swash Buckling), provoke and block... Much better than bash and thrust, IMO. You rarely will use sw attack skills when you learn pierce and stabbing.
Peltasta is the king of PVP, stuns you, knocks you down, etc. The damage you focus on hoplite skills.

The last advancement, you can go to doppel or cataph.

If you go doppel, you ll have very good damage and overheat skills, but will never be as good as a doppel that path from highlander + barbarian, and you cannot combine the finestra hoplite skill (critical + 150 and block + 30%) with 2handsword, forcing you to keep a switch 1handspear-2handsword. So if you came a doppel from hoplite, will never be as good as a doppel that came from highlander or barbarian.

Or you can go to cathap, because allows you to use 2handspear and a mount :ho: .
Hoplite damage skills, imo, are bether than cataph damage skills, considering the damage + cast time and cool down. Almost cataph skills have a high cast time and cool down. If you advance a hoplite 3 to cataph, your pierce and stabbing damage will be increased incredibly using a 2 handspear.